S1 E4 Simple MIndfulness Strategies for an Alcohol Free Life

Jane Ballard (00:01.706)
Welcome to the Mindful Sobriety podcast with your hosts, Jane and Amanda. I'm Jane, a licensed psychotherapist and alcohol-free retreat host. And I'm Amanda, alcohol-free lifestyle coach and yoga instructor. We're so glad you're here. What comes up for you when you hear the word mindfulness? Mindfulness, what comes up? Hmm. So many things.

I think the main thing that comes up for me when I think about mindfulness is making contact with the present moment. And that sounds a little strange, but if you think about it, we are constantly in conversation with ourselves. There are thoughts running through our minds all the time. And oftentimes we are ruminating about the past or we're...

thinking about the future and planning and preparing and sometimes kind of worrying and going through different scenarios. And mindfulness is about getting out of the past, getting out of the future.

And trying to get out of your thoughts even and come back into your body and make contact with right this second. What are you experiencing right this second? And one really easy way to do that is to use your five senses. So thinking, okay, I notice I'm feeling really anxious because I'm thinking about this presentation that I have to do tomorrow and

This feeling is really distressing and I've planned and prepared and I don't need to bruminate about this anymore. It's not going to be helpful. And so just stopping to being like, okay, what are five things I can see right now? Like right now I'm looking at my front window and I see the mail carrier bringing the mail up to the porch and I see the green walls in this room and I see this cup from Joshua tree national park. And.

Jane Ballard (02:09.65)
I see your face smiling back at me and I see my hand here. And what are three things I can hear? I can hear my voice. Can't really hear much because I have a headphone, have a headset on, but usually when you think about it, if you're really quiet, like I just heard some traffic passing by, or sometimes you can even hear your heartbeat or the sound of your own breath.

Yeah. And then thinking when you get quiet, when you slow down, and then what can I smell? Like a lot of times I smell my hair because I can smell some shampoo or some dry shampoo. What can I taste? Like if you have something with you to drink, just taking a sip, even if it's just water, like really noticing, does it have a taste? What does it feel like as I swallow this nice cool water?

Um, what can I feel? So scanning your body, what do I feel in my body? I feel a little bit of tension in my shoulders. I feel like right now I just feel at ease. I don't have any pain and that's actually a really nice thing to not have any pain. And so that right there brings me out of my head, out of this feeling of anxiety and into the reality of the present moment that this is actually

a beautiful morning. I get to be alive another day and breathe and experience life in this human form and what a precious gift that is. Yeah, for sure. I've spent so much time ruminating like you were talking about over what might happen in the future or what someone might be thinking or saying when I'm not present.

And some of these things are just things that I've made up in my head. Like they're not real. And they're just stories, the stories that I've told myself for sure. And a couple of things that I do, tools that I use for mindfulness are, um, I put one hand on my heart and just listen and feel my heartbeat. And that allows me to really drop into my body.

Jane Ballard (04:35.55)
and taking nice long inhales and exhales. And then another more physical thing that I do is I'll just go turn on a water faucet and put my hands under the water. And it kind of brings me into this present moment. Something about the water. Even if I'm having like severe anxiety or something like that, I might even not just use a faucet and run my hands under it. I might even just take a shower.

Something about running the water over your hands or body just is a really powerful way. It's like, okay, you're here in this moment, in this room, and everything's okay. Everything's okay. A lot of times the things we're worried about aren't that big, they're not that deep, as Cody Rixby from Peloton says, it's not that deep.

You know, like in six months, am I going to be worried about the pile of laundry up in my laundry room that needs to be folded and put away? No, I'm not going to care. So why am I letting it steal my joy today? You know, it's not worth it. Um, and with the water, I always think.

Like it's, it's baptismal, like it's, it's literally cleansing and washing away whatever it is, all the old mindsets and all the old ways of being. It's washing all that away if we allow it to. That's a really interesting point. When you think about spiritual practices from various religious traditions, water is a huge part of that.

Like you said, baptism in the Christian tradition. And in Bali, there's this sacred water temple. And you go into the water, you walk into the water wearing a sarong and having your shoulders covered, and you bring an offering and you set it down on this big stone, and then you let, there's like various stations.

Jane Ballard (06:49.014)
where you can let the water flow over you and cleanse you. Like it's a cleansing ritual. And so I think there's something to that. And it can be as simple as turning on the faucet and feeling the water rush over your nerve endings and bring you back, like waken you back up to the beauty that is life. Yeah, definitely comes back to what you were saying about the five senses and checking in with your five senses whenever you're

trying to drop into a mindfulness practice for sure. And then it's really also very powerful when you're in deep conversation with people or just casual conversation. So often we're thinking about what we're going to say next that we're not even listening to say if you're married. For me, I am married and sometimes my husband is talking.

And I'm so busy wanting myself to be heard that I don't even... There's been times I haven't even known what he's saying. So the mindfulness practice really is a powerful tool in communication, whether it be a friendship or a marriage as well. Kind of like listening to understand rather than listening.

to agree or figure out what we want to say or make ourselves understood. It's like, no, let me just be present and hear what this person has to say and try to understand even if I'm experiencing distress while I'm listening to them. I can listen and try to get what they're saying and then respond. And hopefully they're going to listen to me and there will be a more authentic connection that way. Yeah.

I think I heard the term active listening over the past couple of years. I've heard it quite a few times. Yeah. The first time I heard it, I was just like, Oh my gosh, this is something that's been missing and it's a really powerful thing when you look at listening as an action item and, and not just something that you're just like a bystander of, like you're actually.

Jane Ballard (09:11.802)
participating in this. Yeah. When you think about communication skills, there are skills of expression and then there's also skills of listening. And that's a huge component of being a good communicator and making authentic connections with other people is being able to hear them and understand and take it in and help them feel heard and understood. You know, that

that feels like love in a lot of ways is for the other person to hear you and understand you and value what you have to say. Absolutely. Sometimes in yoga, we will, to tune in, we'll rub our hands together at heart center. And so that's another really powerful way to drop into the body. I mean, because you're using the physical sense of touch and just coming home to yourself really at heart center and dropping into the body.

So that would be... I like that. Another powerful way. Like the body is a huge component, it sounds like, of mindfulness and connection to the present moment. Absolutely. What are your thoughts about the difference between mindfulness and meditation? I think mindfulness is a way of being, a way of living. Not to say that...

living a mindful lifestyle, we never drop out of being mindful because we're human. Yeah, but we can't be mindful all the time. It would just be, we probably wouldn't be very productive. Sometimes we need to get lost in whatever the activity is that we're doing. Yeah. So I think mindful, living a mindful life is a lifestyle for sure. Whereas meditation is a practice and

I mean, I guess you could live a meditative lifestyle. You could technically, when people think of meditation, you think of sitting with your legs crossed and your hands on your legs with your eyes closed and then just connecting with your breath. But really, meditation can be done while you're walking or anywhere you're at. So I mean, they really go hand in hand. Don't you think? I think so.

Jane Ballard (11:35.622)
I agree with the part about how, I mean, they're both practices, but I feel like in general, meditation is more of like a structured, I'm going to sit quietly for this amount of time and focus on a mantra or the breath or even like this kind of non-dual form of meditation where you try to lose the sense of self and feel connected.

to everything. Where mindfulness is more of like a remembering to remember to make contact with the present moment and when you find yourself lost, using it as an anchor to come back. Yeah. When I first started my yoga journey, I was all completely into yoga and really didn't know that much about meditation.

But at this point on my journey, I feel much more into meditation. Like I just, I love meditation and it's, I love the ability. I love that meditation can take you somewhere completely different and change your mindset in just a matter of five minutes and yoga can do the same thing. But.

The great thing about meditation is that you can literally do it anywhere, anytime driving down the road and it's just so powerful. Yeah. What are the certain types of meditation that you like to use? So I typically use Vipassana meditation, which is basically kind of the typical meditation that...

most Westerners think of where you connect to the breath or you connect to a mantra. And so sitting, usually closing down the eyes and focusing on breathing. So even just making like, making a soft mental note, like breathing in, breathing out, breathing in, breathing out. And then when the mind starts to wander, which it inevitably does, bringing the

Jane Ballard (14:00.222)
the thoughts back to breathing in, breathing out. And you can even make a soft mental note like thinking, worrying.

or maybe I feel like something's itching, like itching. Okay, now I'm gonna go back to the breath. Yeah, absolutely. I do, I also practice the Vipassana meditation, but I love a good guided meditation for sure. Oh, I do too. Yes. And then breath work also is a form of meditation that I feel like is really powerful. And due to the wandering mind,

I feel like especially square breath where you inhale for the count of four, hold, exhale for the count of four, hold. And I feel like this square breath is super powerful because for those of us that do have a super wandering mind, it just gives us something to focus on. Yes. It connects us with the breath.

You have to stay so focused on your counting one, two, three, four on the inhale and then hold one, two, three, four that your mind can't wander. Yeah, it's just enough mental activity to keep your mind focused and not thinking about the next thing on the to-do list. Yeah. I recently went to a yoga class just a few days ago.

And my instructor, Bree at Haven, I love her. She just did this retreat in Oregon and got certified as a Wim Hof, Wim Hof breathing instructor. Oh, and so she led us through at the beginning of our practice. And at the end, she led us through a Wim Hof breathing exercise. And it was really interesting. And at the end, I think we did a account. So you do like.

Jane Ballard (16:04.03)
I don't know how many, like maybe 30 rounds of breathing in and out. And then at the end, you breathe in and then you breathe out and then you hold the breath. And by the end, we were holding our breath for 45 seconds and it didn't feel that difficult or extreme. Your lungs just kind of warm up to it. And there's something about it. I'm sure it releases epinephrine and dopamine.

you know, feel good neurotransmitters, but it was a very calming centering activity. Yeah. When you mentioned that, I thought of the book by Louise, Hey, you can heal your life. I've heard of her. Yeah, it's amazing. Um, I believe she had cancer of some sort and she literally like killed her own body through all.

Like a completely holistic approach without medication or surgery or anything like that And so when you said that and you were talking about after a while you were holding breath for 45 seconds and it didn't feel Unnatural so But it only took a short time for your lungs to warm up to that and so that's just a really good example of like How quickly the body adapts to new ways of being?

And I think that by incorporating breath work and meditation, like we can literally heal our lives from so much everything. I truly believe everything, but especially anxiety and depression and those types of things. Absolutely. Yeah. It's like exercise.

meditation, breath work, I think those are three of the main tools for accessing alternate states of consciousness without the use of a chemical. And as former drinkers, we probably drank in the past to access an alternate state of mind when we're feeling anxious or down or stressed or whatever it is, it's like, oh, this drink, this chemical fix will...

Jane Ballard (18:23.986)
immediately change the way I'm feeling. And we can still do that in other ways that don't involve ingesting a classified one carcinogen and impairing our ability to make good choices and have insight into our behavior. Yeah, just by exercising or by meditating on a regular basis.

And the more you meditate and kind of strengthen that muscle, the quicker you can get yourself back into that centered place, like that, that alternate state of consciousness where you can see things from a different kind of more zoomed out perspective. Um, and it's, yeah, I think it's, it's one of the most important tools to cultivate in sobriety and in my opinion.

Yeah, and just the tool of zooming out and whenever you're feeling stressed or depressed or whatever emotion that you're feeling, allowing yourself to zoom out and look at your life from the outside and see like what is everything that's going on that might be causing you to feel this way. Yeah. And that can be really powerful. And how significant is it?

You know, sometimes our worries are significant and big and life altering. But a lot of times we're experiencing a lot of distress on a daily basis for things that really won't make a difference in a year or six months or even next week. And so I think zooming out can help us put that in perspective and realize, you know what, things are overall pretty damn good and have a lot to be grateful for. Yeah.

And I'm not going to let this one little niggling thing get in the way of experiencing joy and gratitude and the fullness of life. Yeah. And that alternate state of consciousness that you were talking about that we were striving for by drinking wine or whatever the drink of choice was, that's totally achievable through yoga, meditation, exercise, and breath work, like you said.

Jane Ballard (20:45.258)
The truth about wine, of course, is that it does increase anxiety and depression. But you can, if the true desire is to drink something to relax, there are a lot of options right now that have adaptogens and then like magnesium that will truly do what they're made to do and help you to relax without causing any type of anxiety or depression.

Right. Yeah, I think that alcohol is tricky because in the short term, it immediately alleviates anxiety and depression. But in the long run, in our body's attempt to maintain homeostasis, when we drink, we have this exponential increase in dopamine and serotonin and norepinephrine, all these feel-good neurotransmitters start pumping artificially.

And then our brain is like, wow, something's off here. And so the next day, our brain is producing less of those neurotransmitters in an effort to achieve homeostasis. And then we're feeling down and feeling anxious. You know, our minds are stickier. The, the thoughts that, Oh, why did I say that thing? Or why did I send that text? Or, Oh, I can't believe I did that. Like it's a lot harder to let those things go when we're in that state of. Coming down from alcohol and not just.

getting intoxicated, but I mean like one or two drinks can cause that kind of imbalance in our neurotransmitters and can cause increased depression and anxiety for several days. You know, it takes about three days for the alcohol to be completely out of your system. Yeah. And I think the imbalance or the high, I guess you could say from drinking wine,

actually begins before you even drink the wine. It's like when you've decided you're going to have the wine, something's in your body and it's like it realizes your brain's been notified that it's going to have wine in a few minutes and it's like the effects have already happened. So you were saying that just the anticipation of having that glass of wine or deciding you're going to drink, you already get that boost in dopamine. You know, when you've decided to give into a craving.

Jane Ballard (23:12.106)
Yeah, I'm not sure where I read that or listened and heard that, but I would have never thought that until I did hear it and I replayed my life back. And I was like, oh yeah, that did actually happen to me. Like whenever I would decide I was going to have wine and I would leave my house in the two or three minutes between my house and the grocery store, my body would do something where it was like, I think my heart would start beating really fast. And it was just like, I...

my body was alerted that it was going to get to drink wine, I guess, which is so weird because nothing was going on in my body before that. There was not something that... I wasn't necessarily craving wine, but when I told my brain, we're going to do this, something definitely started happening in my body. Yeah, that is really interesting. And it probably was dopamine. Yeah. The increased heart rate?

Yes. It would be interesting to check someone's blood pressure like before that and then after it. Yeah, get the biofeedback, hook them up to all the monitors and see what's happening. Really interesting. I'm sure someone's done that. I'm sure there's a study on that. We need to look for it. Yeah. I think like this whole mindfulness journey just really comes down to living life on purpose.

Yeah. So tell me about that. Tell me what that means to you living life on purpose. Just being really intentional about where and who I choose to spend my time with. And when I am spending time with those people to be present with them and I'm not always doing great as far as that goes. I mean, I do get distracted with my family. But on a good day, I'm aware of that.

And I think we, it's a, you know, it's a lifelong practice and some days we do well and some days we don't, but it's all about continuing to try. Absolutely. I was doing some work on my computer a few days ago. And this, this is part of, for me, living life on purpose is like I was, so I was working on my computer. My son was in here and then he left to go hang out with some friends.

Jane Ballard (25:38.29)
And I was like, man, I missed the chance to chit chat with my 17 year old for a few minutes. And so I texted him, I was like, I'm so sorry I was distracted while you were here. And he was his response was that he was so happy that I am doing what I'm doing, doing the recovery coach thing like coaching clients.

He's like, it's just so good that you have this thing that you can do for yourself that you love doing that isn't all about taking care of us all the time. And it was such an interesting response because I didn't realize how much freedom this gives to my family. Like number one, my husband not feeling like he has to take care of me anymore. And then my kids knowing like mom has a life also.

Like she has other interests and a whole identity outside of taking care of us. Yeah. And I think in the beginning, there was so much shame that came with that because. I don't know about you, but I was not raised to as a mom that you should have your own life. Like I was raised that your kids should be your life. Yeah, no, I was too. My mom was very devoted to, to us. That was her life for a long time.

I think the mindfulness is a balance of that, where your kids are everything, but you're also really important also. You know? Yeah, they're an aspect of our lives, a very, very important one, but they're not everything. And in some way they are, but they can't be, you know, we have to be multi-dimensional humans. Like we are, whether we,

want to be or not. And so I think it's important to kind of nourish these other aspects of ourselves, like this drive to be creative and to contribute to the world in a greater way. And I don't know, just to have a multi-dimensional identity, I think, is part of being a healthy human. And when we suppress that, I don't think it's good for anyone, including our children.

Jane Ballard (28:01.566)
And I don't want to model for my girls that to be successful as a parent, they have to lose themselves. Absolutely. I think that whenever we do find balance with loving ourselves and loving our families and creating that mindful balance of all of it, that we are doing them a favor.

Jane Ballard (28:30.974)
really loving ourselves well or cutting out time for ourselves. Yeah. I think that we can't be the best versions of ourselves like that. I agree. Yeah. It's like, we have to nourish our body, mind and spirit. And that takes time and intention. That doesn't happen by living on autopilot.

and constantly going from one task to the next. Like it does require. Just a change in kind of the construct of how you lead your life. You have to be intentional about it. And I want to model that value for my kids. But it doesn't happen by accident. Like I have to carve out that time and. You know, I struggle still with mom guilt and.

You know, feeling selfish or like I'm not giving enough to them or devoting enough time to them. And maybe someday I'll look back on it and realize I've made mistakes or that I have taken too much time for myself. I don't know. But I know that I am a better mother to them when I feel like I'm in balance. Absolutely. For sure. Yeah. You can't pour from an empty cup. Yeah.

For me, it felt so foreign to want to invest in myself. When I first started going on yoga retreats or even signing up for studio memberships or many kind of classes that I wanted to take, like it felt really uncomfortable because it just was not something that I had done.

But it was only uncomfortable for me. My family was like, go ahead, you know? I want you to do this, we love you. So it's just an interesting perspective living in a mom's, being the mom and living inside my head and making a transition. You know, if we've...

Jane Ballard (30:49.278)
We worry that we're taking something away from our kids by investing in ourselves, but then they're actually saying, no, mom, we want you to, we like this. Like, we want you to be happy and fulfilled and take time and resources to invest in you. Yeah. And, you know, this, the topic that we, you and I both live our lives by, which is an alcohol-free lifestyle, it can be,

a really vulnerable topic. And especially when we're talking about it in this way, like publicly. And so I had this fear and I think I still have it there a little bit still. That like, how will this affect my kids? And my younger son is two, I don't know yet. You know, like, he's 12. And I just think he doesn't think that much about it. But I know that

has given it some thought and like, I think he really respects it. Yeah. And I think that even though luckily he hasn't lived it like I have, it's been a really good learning experience for him. Absolutely, just you modeling that life can be fun and adventurous and exciting without any kind of chemical. You know, you don't have to drink to have fun. There's...

just some of the most meaningful experiences I've ever had have been without alcohol, the most meaningful ones. And so I think letting our kids see that as such a gift. Absolutely. I thought I was... Oh, go ahead. Sorry, go ahead. I was just going to say, like, I think that part of our mission is to change the dialogue around living alcohol-free and sobriety and to de-stigmatize it. Like it's not...

something that we should be ashamed of. It's not like we're failed drinkers who are forced to live this life of deprivation. It's a lifestyle choice, you know? Yeah. It's like choosing to be vegetarian. Yes. Or whatever. Because we feel better this way. Yes. Or going dairy free or gluten free. It's like I don't want to feel like shit, so I don't drink alcohol.

Jane Ballard (33:17.566)
I don't want to do anything embarrassing so I don't drink alcohol. Right. I don't want to have missing parts of my memory from a night out with friends. I want to remember everything and be completely present. Yeah, for sure. And, and that's the really, my favorite part of this whole thing is that we get to pick how we want this to look for us. Like we don't, there is no path.

that has been carved that you have to walk this path a certain way. Like you get to make your own rules. And this is not 1985 where like there was only alcohol, alcoholics anonymous. Like there are a lot of different ways and pathways to whether you want to call it recovery or an alcohol free lifestyle or whatever you would like to call it. Like there's so many different options. Right.

this, it doesn't have to be dictated by a set of rules and labels and dogma. It can be whatever the person chooses it to be. You know, you can count days or you cannot count days. You can call yourself sober. You can call yourself alcohol-free. You can be sober curious and say, I'm not drinking tonight. I don't know. Maybe I'll drink tomorrow, but I'm not going to drink today.

Jane Ballard (34:46.838)
why you're not drinking is I'm on a mindfulness journey. Yeah, I love that. So in order to be fully present on this mindfulness journey, I can't have alcohol because then I would not be fully present anymore. That's a really good point. Like it's like a spiritual journey in a way. This journey is very spiritual.

in a different way than I had ever experienced spirituality my entire life. Yeah. Tell me more about that. Just feeling more connected to our Creator? I think when we don't put substances in our bodies that...

it just creates an openness. I truly believe that when we put substances in our body, like it causes a definite block between us and God. Yeah. And so when we are no longer putting anything like that into our bodies, it just kind of completely clears that block. I felt that before I got sober. That was one of the things I think that led me to that.

Epiphany that I was ready to give up alcohol was I would be feeling so close to God and so connected. And then I would have a couple of drinks and then it would take me days to get back to that place. It is like a barrier or a block or. I don't know, like a lower vibration. I know that sounds very new agey, but it's like, you're just on this different plane.

with alcohol or recovering from alcohol versus, you know, completely alcohol-free.

Jane Ballard (36:35.838)
I would say low vibration, high vibration. It does sound new age, but I love it. I like that language for sure. It is very fitting. And I also for me like this journey, when I said it's more spiritual, then it's much more of a spiritual experience than anything I've ever had in my life before is because I stopped just listening to.

what I heard people say, say a pastor or whatever, preacher or a theologist from a podcast or whatever. Like I started doing a deep dive into what feels good for me and my body. And like what feels good in my heart when I hear that or certain things. And just realizing that just because a certain person says something doesn't necessarily mean it, that that's going to be an alignment for me.

So it's almost like this experiential knowing. Intuition, maybe? Yeah. Like, what does this feel like in my body when I reflect on this spiritual concept or theological concept? Yeah. And also, like, if it is shame and guilt, or fear or doubt, especially shame and guilt, that is not from God. That is not from God. I do not believe shame and guilt are from God.

And so I think that if there were something that someone was teaching you and it made you feel shame and guilt, like I would, those are things that are not in alignment with me anymore. Mm hmm. Yeah. I agree for the most part, but I think that sometimes guilt serves a purpose when we have actually done something that needs to be repaired or acknowledged.

And it kind of urges us, the discomfort of guilt urges us to do that. But I think a lot of times we feel guilt based on narratives that we've created in our minds that, um, aren't effective and guilt then keeps us stuck and leads to shame. Yeah. I think a lot of my shame and guilt was trauma is trauma based and that I was allowing in my mind sense was all from a.

Jane Ballard (39:02.766)
childlike mind. And I think that trauma, that's guilt is a huge component of being the recipient of trauma and developing these stuck points of, well, if I had done this and it wouldn't have happened or I felt this and so I must have been a willing participant or whatever, you know, we make up all these narratives that aren't helpful, you know, bottom line is.

It's not your fault and you don't have any responsibility in the fact that it happened.

Jane Ballard (39:42.094)
I mean, I think we could do an entire episode talking about guilt and shame and spirituality and even just healing from guilt and shame and how much freedom comes from that. We'll definitely add this to our calendar. If any of our listeners have questions, send them in and we'd love to answer them on the episode.

Jane Ballard (40:11.55)
life experiences about guilt and shame. We would love to hear your story. Yeah, I feel like that plays such a huge role in alcohol use and other substance use. And it keeps people feeling stuck, you know, because it's such a painful, awful feeling. And it feels like one of the best ways to alleviate it is just to avoid it and drink. And so it just, it just

perpetuates this vicious cycle. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, and only through healing comes from sobriety. Yeah. Yeah, and from sitting with those emotions and allowing ourselves to feel uncomfortable. And then when we do allow ourselves to feel uncomfortable, we heal. Yes, and we realize that all those emotions come and go anyway, they don't last forever.

They may return, but at some point they will pass and we will feel peace again. Yes. Yeah. Well, this was, this was fun talking about mindfulness and faith and sobriety. Some of my favorite topics. Yes, it was, it was so good. I loved, I loved the topic of mindfulness for today. And then.

just the window of opportunity that mindfulness always opens up. Yeah, for sure. All right. Well, thanks, guys, for listening. Take care. Thank you so much for joining us today. We value each and every one of you. Until next time, may you be safe, may you be well, may you be peaceful and at ease.